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Katrina
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Location: Uranus
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 Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2005 7:40 pm Post subject: Terri's Fight |
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The fact that a stie like this has to exist is kind of sickening...
http://www.terrisfight.org
Basically, through power of attorney, a woman's husband is able to refuse her therapy and remove a feeding tube even though she's conciouss and responds to those around her. Incidently, the guy's living with his girlfriend and has two kids with her. The woman's parents can't really do anything legally, and her death date is set for the 18th of March.
Well, congratulations, Mr. $&*%#(& and our $(*%&#& court system, I hope you can all sleep well at night. 
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fate
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Joined: 11 Sep 2003
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| Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2005 9:07 pm Post subject: |
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cases like this are really iffy, on the one hand why not just give her care over to the parents and then not deal with her anymore if that's what the guy wants....then there's the issue of does she want to be alive...which i find weird to make for another person which is why i think these things should be declared in writing by the person before something happens to them...but that's ideal world. Then there's also the money thing which i'm sure plays in here somewhere.
if you think this is one of the worst things the legal system has done though, you should read up on our legal system. Those people will have no trouble sleeping tonight.
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Jastermereel
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| Posted: Tue Mar 15, 2005 9:52 am Post subject: |
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| So far I haven't found on the site, or elsewhere, mention of her preferences in the matter. So a question for you: If she wished to die and not live in the state she is in, would you still be as outraged? |
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Jastermereel
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| Posted: Sun Mar 20, 2005 4:37 pm Post subject: |
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Editing to shorten the link to avoid forum format issues. Cut and past the two halves together if you are still insterested in this link:
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/03/18/national/18cnd-schiavo.html?
ex=1268802000&en=7f73b9fa30c9ee7c&ei=5090"ner=rssuserland
| Quote: | Bill Frist, Republican of Tennessee and the Senate majority leader, issued a statement saying that the woman, Terri Schiavo, and her husband, Michael, were being invited to testify in a Congressional inquiry into the matter later this month.
The statement pointed out that Federal law protects witnesses called before Congress "from anyone who may obstruct or impede a witness's attendance or testimony."
The maneuver is the latest step by lawmakers determined to keep Ms. Schiavo alive to prevent her feeding tube from being disconnected, scheduled for 1 p.m. today. |
Yes...thats right. Terri Schiavo has been called to testify before congress. [Edit: Yes, this turns out to be a few days old, thankfuly (if only for acting against abject idiocy), overruled for now at least.]
| Quote: | | From Linda Douglass on ABC News tonight (no transcript available online):ABC News has obtained talking points circulated among Republican senators explaining why they should vote to intervene in the Schiavo case. Among them: "This is an important moral issue and the pro-life base will be excited..." and "This is a great political issue... this is a tough issue for Democrats." |
Anyone want to claim that this isn't just a series of sleezy political stunts done by the pro-life movement (and yes it is the same old crowd, Randall Terry and all)? This debate and manufactured outrage have nothing to do 'saving' the empty shell that was long long ago someone named Terri, but instead have everything to do with manupulative political thuggery.
Anyone else heard of Frist making a 'diagnosis' based on watching some videos?
This is a joke. It shouldn't be. But it has become one. It truly has.
Last edited by Jastermereel on Fri Mar 25, 2005 11:24 am; edited 3 times in total |
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fate
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fate
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Jastermereel
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| Posted: Mon Mar 21, 2005 10:46 am Post subject: |
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http://www.crooksandliars.com/2005/03/21.html
But the next one is better: http://www.crooksandliars.com/2005/03/20.html
It should never have gotten to this point. Especially not as orchestrated by the side that traditionally has claimed to try to keep the government as far from it's citizens as possible.
So yes katrina, it is sickening that a site like that has to exist. Pushing one family's troubles into the legislative state is rather sick indeed. And, while it is small compared to the rest of it all, consider what terri might have wanted. This has happened to her due to complications with her bulimia. Do you think she would have wanted to have her permanantly vegitative self displayed and paraded around for all the world to see?
Still, you want to get pissy about this one meatbag's feeding tube? Check the past legislation. Bush, who just signed a bill rushed through congress making this one case an exception, has, in the past, signed legislation just to the contrary, resulting in many more people having the tube removed (living will or not). Oddly though, you don't seem that upset about those people.
Somehow, I suspect you didn't have trouble sleeping at night then. |
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Trool
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| Posted: Mon Mar 21, 2005 3:21 pm Post subject: |
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I agree with mereel it seems like in this case the cast is reversed. Reading the summary it feels like a summary for a death row case with everything just reversed...
If this thing does anything it highlights the importance of living wills, there wouldn't be a mess if there was one. It's hard to say what she'd really want otherwise, I heard somewhere...and if i find the link i'll post it....that terri was a romman catholic, if that's true and she's devout than it gives more credence to her parant's argument, however it's really hard/impossible to know anything.
It is frightening though that our gov is passing what they call:
| Quote: | | A private bill provides benefits to specified individuals (including corporate bodies). Individuals sometimes request relief through private legislation when administrative or legal remedies are exhausted |
I've always assumed that any laws passed must apply to all or none...i guess I'm very wrong on this....
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Jastermereel
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| Posted: Mon Mar 21, 2005 4:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Trool wrote: | | If this thing does anything it highlights the importance of living wills, there wouldn't be a mess if there was one. It's hard to say what she'd really want otherwise, I heard somewhere...and if i find the link i'll post it....that terri was a romman catholic, if that's true and she's devout than it gives more credence to her parant's argument, however it's really hard/impossible to know anything. |
Her parents have said before, on several occasions, that the presence of a living will would be irrelevant to them and that they'd still keep up this sick delusional campaign. Those, of course, aren't their words exactly, but they've made their stance quite clear. Besides that bit, it isn't as if terri is really there anyway. If she were in a coma, or another similar state with some mental facilities, it might be one thing, but terri doesn't exist in any form but the afformentioned 'meatbag' way. Their daughter, and this man's wife already died fifteen years back. The parents, and some other people who have no basis for being involved, just don't quite understand that yet.
Edit: I've recently heard that durring the plentiful court proceedings long prior to this time, it came out that both her husband, her brother-in-law and sister-in-law, and many of her friends have revealed that she had said on occasions that she would "not want to live like that".
BTW. This is now officialy a fringe issue:
http://pollingreport.com/news.htm |
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fate
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| Posted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 10:46 am Post subject: |
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the bill signed on her behalf: http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=109_cong_bills&docid=f:s686cps.txt.pdf
essencially a bill was signed for one person/one family to give them special treatment within the court system....
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Trool
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| Posted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 12:48 pm Post subject: |
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just a quick search brought these up:
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/subjects.xpd?type=crs&term=Private%20legislation
if anyone can find a more complete list of these things please post....
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Jastermereel
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Katrina
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| Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2005 9:17 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Anyone want to claim that this isn't just a series of sleezy political stunts done by the pro-life movement (and yes it is the same old crowd, Randall Terry and all)? This debate and manufactured outrage have nothing to do 'saving' the empty shell that was long long ago someone named Terri, but instead have everything to do with manupulative political thuggery. |
Speaking from the point of someone who had to watch a loved one in this state, yes I DO want to argue that claim. My grandmother stayed for months in a very similar state, and she needed help breathing and eating. She was not a vegetable. She was a person I loved dearly who was happy to see me when I came and sad when I left. She was no less my grandmother then than she was when I was six and she was healthy.
*sarcasm* Oh yes, those vicious pro-life people are just hatching evil plots as they sit there and cry outside the hospice. No, this has nothing to do with how much they love Terri. It's all a ploy to trick you. *end sarcasm*
People are not standing outside the hospice crying to move a political debate or to manipulate the media. Pro-life people, despite the media, are mostly concerned with just that, saving lives. Other people may have a different definition of what life is, thus the argument.
| Jastermereel wrote: | | So far I haven't found on the site, or elsewhere, mention of her preferences in the matter. So a question for you: If she wished to die and not live in the state she is in, would you still be as outraged? |
The problem is, she didn't have a living will. All I'm saying is, if Terri has not specifically asked to die, why kill her? If we're unsure of a person's wishes, isn't it better to give the benefit of the doubt that she didn't particularly want to starve to death? At the very least, her "husband" has more than enough reason to bias and should not be the person making this decision.
| Quote: | | if you think this is one of the worst things the legal system has done though, you should read up on our legal system. Those people will have no trouble sleeping tonight. |
Unfortunatly, I know our legal system has done worse... this just happened to be the pick of the day...
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fate
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| Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2005 11:02 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | My grandmother stayed for months in a very similar state, and she needed help breathing and eating. She was not a vegetable. |
similar is not the same, these things must be discussed on case by case basis. You grandmother may have still had her mental capacity while having a damaged body/basic life sustainin functions, Terri on the other hand is missing the entire center of her brain.
| Quote: | | At the very least, her "husband" has more than enough reason to bias and should not be the person making this decision. |
her husband has not been the only one making the desision, there have been at least one(and possibly more) court appointed guardian ad litem for Terri whose only job was her best interest. He also recomended tube removal. While the husband appears shady in this, the parents appear just as shady. They seem more interested in keepin her alive for their own benefit(to have someone to visit, someone's hand to hold, etc)
| Quote: | *sarcasm* Oh yes, those vicious pro-life people are just hatching evil plots as they sit there and cry outside the hospice. No, this has nothing to do with how much they love Terri. It's all a ploy to trick you. *end sarcasm*
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individuals outside the hospice are not the political movement....the politicians involved are very far from wanting to save anyone's life and are much more interested in their own careers.
| Quote: | | Pro-life people, despite the media, are mostly concerned with just that, saving lives. Other people may have a different definition of what life is, thus the argument. |
this really depends on the pro-life person, some are genuinely concerned and want to reduce abortions/save what they consider to be lives. Others however are much more clearly fighting to limit women's rights....specifically those who are of the "she should have kept her legs closed" opinion. These are also the people who believe that abstinence only education will keep teens from having sex/getting pregnant despite nationwide statistics which indicate the complete opposite.
Then of course there's also those who are opposed to birth controll in the first place and consider it an abortifishient(sp?)...these are the people who have most likely removed themselves from science...
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Most of the time its easier to get along with people before you get to know them. |
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Jastermereel
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| Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2005 11:23 am Post subject: |
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| Katrina wrote: | | Speaking from the point of someone who had to watch a loved one in this state, yes I DO want to argue that claim. My grandmother stayed for months in a very similar state, and she needed help breathing and eating. She was not a vegetable. She was a person I loved dearly who was happy to see me when I came and sad when I left. She was no less my grandmother then than she was when I was six and she was healthy. |
Makes note of the newly highlighted part. I'm sorry for what she went through but she has absolutely nothing to do with this. Theres an immence difference between someone who needs help while recovering and someone who will never recover and is, by all reasonable standards, already gone.
| Quote: | | *sarcasm* Oh yes, those vicious pro-life people are just hatching evil plots as they sit there and cry outside the hospice. No, this has nothing to do with how much they love Terri. It's all a ploy to trick you. *end sarcasm* |
I'm sure all those people outside the hospital all have met terri and love her dearly. I'm sure Randall Terry, the militant pro-life (yes, i do mean militant) organizer who is responsible for much of this organizing, also loves terri very much. This is to say nothing of those politicians who are doing so much to keep this story (and the PVS terri) grotesquely alive. Whoops, i forgot to add my *sarcasm* notes. I'm sure there are some people there who belive they do care such as the person going on a hunger strike for terri (apparently ignorant of the primary cause of her condition - huzzah! lets have a hunger strike for bulimia!). But no one in this matter, with the expection of her very close friends and family can honestly make the claim that they love terri. For these people outside the hospital, and those people down in congress to make any claim to love terri is nothing but a sick sick joke.
| Quote: | | People are not standing outside the hospice crying to move a political debate or to manipulate the media. Pro-life people, despite the media, are mostly concerned with just that, saving lives. Other people may have a different definition of what life is, thus the argument. |
If they really wanted to save lives they might reconsider their causes. Instead of standing vigil over a woman who, for all intents and purposes, died fifteen years ago and is kept 'alive' as a sort of sick puppet for her parents, they might try protesting the laws that their newly reelected leaders have in place that is actually killing people. You'd think they'd be rather upset about how a law that george bush signed (some time back while as governer) allowed a hospital to take a young recovering boy off of life support against his guardian's wishes because she couldn't pay. Even while sick, that young child was far more alive than terri will ever be again. Strangely, they aren't at all vocal about this. Wouldn't this be something far more significant? A person, actually alive, let go despite his mother's protests. Isn't that something this group would care about a bit more than a woman who is already gone and had expressed a desire to go?
| Quote: | | The problem is, she didn't have a living will. All I'm saying is, if Terri has not specifically asked to die, why kill her? If we're unsure of a person's wishes, isn't it better to give the benefit of the doubt that she didn't particularly want to starve to death? At the very least, her "husband" has more than enough reason to bias and should not be the person making this decision. |
It is true that she didn't have a living will, and it is also true that her parents have made it clear that it wouldn't have mattered to them and that they would have fought this anyway, even if she did have one explicitly describing the circumstances and asking for death. Beyond that, in a series of court cases with testimony from friends and family it was shown repeatedly, that she had expressed a wish not to be kept alive under these sort of circumstances.So no, it isn't the problem that she didn't have a living will. Yes, she specifically asked to die. Numerous trials over the past fifteen years have established her wishes.
Lastly, it isn't clear why you dislike her husband so, other than him holding the opposite political view from you on this matter. The thing is, for you, whether you admit it or not, it is political. You can relate to it perhaps, but to those who haven't actually met terri, this is politics. It can be a social issue you feel strongly about, but it is for you, just social politics. For her husband, it has been his life for the past fifteen years. Perhaps you dislike him because he started dating six years after she died (Yes, she is brain dead and has been so, she is dead). Did you object when 9/11 widows married a year after the attack? I must have missed that thread.
You seem angry with him because he wants to follow his wife's expressed wishes. I am angry because a bunch of crazed activists, who have no personal stake in the matter at all, saw this case as a perfect vehicle for their cause and dragged this family stuggle into the national arena.
You think you know what terri would want? What on earth makes you think that this national circus, waiving pictures of her brain-dead shell about, is anything close to what she would have wanted? |
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Katrina
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| Posted: Sat Mar 26, 2005 10:49 am Post subject: |
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My grandmother did not need help recovering; she was in hospice. We knew she would not recover, but that was no reason to shorten her life anymore. I know it's not exactly the same, but that's why I drew the parallell.
Technically, until a death cerfiticate is signed, Terri is legally alive. I have no issues if her husband decides to divorce her because they can no longer have a relationship and begin dating again, but he's not doing that. He's holding onto the marriage and dating someone on the side. That's why I say that he's biased to make decisions. (I don't recall what I said about 911 victims, I don't think I got heavily involved in that discussion.)
I think teh reason this case has become so political is because it can really open doors for other "right-to-die" cases and has the potential for heavy misuse. (Let's face it, if someone stands to gain something from someone's death and they have a serious injury or illness, it's very easy to say "they wanted to die" just to get an inheritance or life insurance.) I'm not saying it's right that people pretend to love Terri who don't care about her at all, but it's usually single cases that end up pushing controversial laws like this.
| Quote: | | You'd think they'd be rather upset about how a law that george bush signed (some time back while as governer) allowed a hospital to take a young recovering boy off of life support against his guardian's wishes because she couldn't pay. Even while sick, that young child was far more alive than terri will ever be again. Strangely, they aren't at all vocal about this. |
I didn't hear about this at all. I'd actually be surprised as well. I'm not sure how long ago it was, but if you have any links, I'd be curious to read.
| Quote: | | Isn't that something this group would care about a bit more than a woman who is already gone and had expressed a desire to go? |
Again, she did not express a desire to go. If she had, her parents really wouldn't have an argument, even if they wanted to. Although I would still argue against her being "gone" based on what I've seen in regards to the case.. I do not claim to know what Terri wanted - I don't know her. What I'm saying is that I personally feel that it is not right to remove life support unless the person specifically requests it.
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Jastermereel
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| Posted: Sat Mar 26, 2005 12:14 pm Post subject: |
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Double post. Had server issues.
Last edited by Jastermereel on Sat Mar 26, 2005 12:35 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Jastermereel
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| Posted: Sat Mar 26, 2005 12:20 pm Post subject: |
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| Katrina wrote: | | My grandmother did not need help recovering; she was in hospice. We knew she would not recover, but that was no reason to shorten her life anymore. I know it's not exactly the same, but that's why I drew the parallell. |
| Katrina wrote: | | She was a person I loved dearly who was happy to see me when I came and sad when I left. |
If you note the bold portion of your earlier post there really is no parallel to draw. Its that simple.
| Quote: | | Technically, until a death cerfiticate is signed, Terri is legally alive. |
How many people then do you suspect are 'legally' alive and yet actually dead? I can see the scene now. Someone is shot through the head with a high caliber rifle. The skull is notably hollowed out. A doctor rushes to the scene. He investigates the body and cries out, "He is alive!" Moments later his assistant hands him a clipboard and a pen. He scribbles on it for a moment and proclaims, "He is dead!" Now, you tell me. In the period between when the man lost most of his brain and when the doc put his John Hancock down on the page, was the man dead?
| Quote: | | I have no issues if her husband decides to divorce her because they can no longer have a relationship and begin dating again, but he's not doing that. He's holding onto the marriage and dating someone on the side. That's why I say that he's biased to make decisions. (I don't recall what I said about 911 victims, I don't think I got heavily involved in that discussion.)[Rest of the quote trimmed for formatting convenience.] |
For the moment I'm going to skip the discussion on why calling 'bias' in a case involving a loved one is absurd. If it isn't evident, explaining it really won't help.
What exactly is it that you think Mr. Schaivo stands to gain from his dead wife? Do you really think he has spent the last fifteen years going through this for some life insurance? Is it possible, just possible, that he is actually trying to bring it to an end the way she would have wanted (according to the sworn testimony of some of her closest friends and family)?
Also, I do agree that it is frequently a controversial case that can push a movement but normally if a law goes through it affects more than one person rather than congress doing it on a case by case basis. Not only is that in itself absurd but it is downright grotesque when they make this bit of absurdity so high profile when they are even now activly seeking to undermine the very health care system that terri's body has been hooked up to for the past fifteen years and the court system that provided the settlement that funded that setup.
| Quote: | | Quote: | | You'd think they'd be rather upset about how a law that george bush signed (some time back while as governer) allowed a hospital to take a young recovering boy off of life support against his guardian's wishes because she couldn't pay. Even while sick, that young child was far more alive than terri will ever be again. Strangely, they aren't at all vocal about this. |
I didn't hear about this at all. I'd actually be surprised as well. I'm not sure how long ago it was, but if you have any links, I'd be curious to read. |
I did make a mistake in that in that the boy apparently was not recovering. I apologize for that, however the rest is here: http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/metropolitan/3084934
The law that allowed the action was signed by bush as governer of texas in 1999. I'll likely be able to track down a bit more if you'd like further information to become angry about but I don't suspect that story will get much further news coverage without the pro-life circus rallying around the kid. Apparently his tiny little body doesn't sustain their political machine the same way terri's empty shell does.
| Quote: | | Quote: | | Isn't that something this group would care about a bit more than a woman who is already gone and had expressed a desire to go? |
Again, she did not express a desire to go. If she had, her parents really wouldn't have an argument, even if they wanted to. |
Again, she has. The lenghty series of legal workings over the many years have revealed and confirmed this. She had indeed expressed this desire on occasions prior to her condition. And again, her parents have stated that they would have done the same thing they have done even if she had previously formed legal documentation to this end.
| Quote: | | Although I would still argue against her being "gone" based on what I've seen in regards to the case. |
As posted earlier: http://www.miami.edu/ethics2/schiavo/CT%20scan.png
Gone.
| Quote: | | I do not claim to know what Terri wanted - I don't know her. |
And yet you claim that those who did know her, who know what she wanted are wrong. Doesn't this strike you as a bit odd?
| Quote: | | What I'm saying is that I personally feel that it is not right to remove life support unless the person specifically requests it. |
Alright then. It is settled. We pull the tube (and leave it out). Years and years of trials involving her close friends and her family have revealed her wishes. Tata' Terri. Despite some peoples claims, we barely knew ye. |
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Katrina
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| Posted: Sun Mar 27, 2005 10:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Now, you tell me. In the period between when the man lost most of his brain and when the doc put his John Hancock down on the page, was the man dead? |
Techinically, yes. Legally, no, but in such a case, it really doesn't make a difference.
| Quote: | | What exactly is it that you think Mr. Schaivo stands to gain from his dead wife? Do you really think he has spent the last fifteen years going through this for some life insurance? Is it possible, just possible, that he is actually trying to bring it to an end the way she would have wanted (according to the sworn testimony of some of her closest friends and family)? |
Arg! I didn't say he was doing that! (Actually, I specifially stated that I didn't mean to imply it.) I was saying that if he's allowed to do this, it opens the door for other cases where someone might try to take a relative off life support just for money. My impression from the situation is that he is more thinking about what he wants for Terri, not what Terri the person wants right now. Her parents would swear to complete opposite, that she doesn't want to have the feeding tube removed. She is definatly not unconcious, there is video and photographs to prove that.
| Quote: | | I'll likely be able to track down a bit more if you'd like further information to become angry about but I don't suspect that story will get much further news coverage without the pro-life circus rallying around the kid. Apparently his tiny little body doesn't sustain their political machine the same way terri's empty shell does. |
It's alright, I was just curious because I hadn't heard about it. Contrary to your belief, I don't seek stuff to get angry about. Just because I disagree with you on this issue doesn't mean I find some odd pleasure in being pissed off.
I'm not totally sure how to read the picture. Yes, if you want to call me a hypocritcal idiot who doesn't even know what I'm talking about, fine. I've already been called part of a massive circus for what I believe in, so what's a few more insults on top of that?
I actually found the Terri case in checking one of the mailing lists I'm on. I didn't think it would turn into a heated debate like this. Frankly, I'm ready to end it, because quite honestly, I apparently open myself up to ridicule whenever I post my opinion on such issues. I get enough insults on campus when people feel the need to write nasty messages on my door so I'd rather keep quiet than get more here from friends.
Likewise, if I have insulted anyone in my conversation, I apologize. I meant only to state my feelings and opinions in regards to this issue.
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Last edited by Katrina on Tue Mar 29, 2005 7:17 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Jastermereel
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| Posted: Sun Mar 27, 2005 11:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Katrina wrote: |
I'm not totally sure how to read the picture. Yes, if you want to call me a hypocritcal idiot who doesn't even know what I'm talking about, fine. I've already been called part of a massive circus for what I believe in, so what's a few more insults on top of that? |
I wouldn't know how to read it either save that it was posted earlier in this thread with explanation. My post just referenced back to it. In that earlier link it explained, "That dark space is cerebrospinal fluid." Normally, that would be brain stuffs. Now its spinal fluid. Simply put, most of her brain is gone. What actually made Terri, Terri, or even what made her considered alive and not simply a bag of meat, is long gone.
As for her being 'consious', and the videos of her 'responding':
| Quote: | In 1990, Terri Schiavo?s heart stopped beating. Due to a catastrophic imbalance of potassium levels in her system, possibly caused by an eating disorder, her body essentially crashed, stopping her heart and depriving her brain of oxygen for 10 minutes. The resulting brain damage has left her in a persistent vegetative state.
This is different than a coma, in which a person appears to be asleep constantly, or brain death, in which there is no sign of activity in the brain whatsoever, and in many ways it is more painful, since the reflexes of the brain stem continue to function.Terri?s eyes close when she is asleep and open when she is awake, although her wakeful state is nothing like full consciousness. If her eyes are touched, she blinks, and if something obstructs her air passages, she coughs. But her cerebral cortex is essentially gone, replaced with cerebro-spinal fluid. Sometimes patients in persistent vegetative states partially recover; it is not unheard of to have people sent into the state by head trauma regain some cognitive ability, although generally they remain disabled. A persistent vegetative state that was caused by lack of oxygen to the brain that lasts for five years, however, is considered by medical science to be permanent and irremediable. Terri Schiavo has been in a persistent vegetative state for fifteen years. |
Fromhttp://www.rawstory.com/exclusives/dara/schiavo_032405.htm
I don't claim that the site isn't one with a slant to it, but that information is what i've heard elsewhere, just summarized more nicely. |
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Jastermereel
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| Posted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 11:01 am Post subject: |
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http://www.nytimes.com/2005/03/29/politics/29donate.html
Just a further update.
| Quote: | The parents of Terri Schiavo have authorized a conservative direct-mailing firm to sell a list of their financial supporters, making it likely that thousands of strangers moved by her plight will receive a steady stream of solicitations from anti-abortion and conservative groups.
"These compassionate pro-lifers donated toward Bob Schindler's legal battle to keep Terri's estranged husband from removing the feeding tube from Terri," says a description of the list on the Web site of the firm, Response Unlimited, which is asking $150 a month for 6,000 names and $500 a month for 4,000 e-mail addresses of people who responded last month to an e-mail plea from Ms. Schiavo's father. "These individuals are passionate about the way they value human life, adamantly oppose euthanasia and are pro-life in every sense of the word!"
Privacy experts said the sale of the list was legal and even predictable, if ghoulish. |
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Katrina
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Joined: 11 Oct 2003
Posts: 215
Location: Uranus
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| Posted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 7:10 pm Post subject: |
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Yeah, I got on a "pro-family" mailing list based on a poll I voted in at some point. I wanted to smack the people who did it. Soliciting people does not help a cause. If people feel strongly about pro-life issues, they'll get involved on their own.
Gomen, I didn't see the part of your last post that explained the scan.  Assuming it's accurate, Terri's a bit of a medical miracle already, considering a feeding tube is all she needs.
I think I heard that she recently passed away. At least I saw a headline mentioning something an autopsy. Anyone hear anything else?
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Check it out! I finally remembered my login for this account. I can do crazy things like put text in my signature and change my avatar so it doesn't say NaNoWriMo 2005. |
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Jastermereel
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| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2005 7:51 am Post subject: |
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| Katrina wrote: | Gomen, I didn't see the part of your last post that explained the scan. Assuming it's accurate, Terri's a bit of a medical miracle already, considering a feeding tube is all she needs.
I think I heard that she recently passed away. At least I saw a headline mentioning something an autopsy. Anyone hear anything else? |
Two things. First, unless i'm mistaken, its a tube for water, not food, contrary to the frequently reused misinformation all over the place. She isn't going to starve, but instead dehydrate. Its significant because everything else is supplied through other means as it isn't all she needs. Most if not all other functions are maintained with hospital aid if i remember correctly.
As for the second point, last I heard she passed away 15 years ago, but, no, it seems like the news is still reporting the appeals and such and not her autopsy so the body did not yet start to truly decay. Amazing how it's been preserved after death so long. |
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rklee
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Joined: 11 Sep 2003
Posts: 495
Location: Malvern, PA Pittsburgh, PA
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| Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2005 9:55 am Post subject: |
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My first post here? 
I think even biologically though she's not 'dead'. What's required for life from biology? I don't remember exactly. She eats food, produces waste, uses energy, reacts...etc. But being biologically alive means little. A plant is biologically alive.
I don't know what the medical conditions required for 'death' is. I'm sure she passes those tests too, it's probably based on brain activity which I believe she still has (in the still existing portions of her brain).
Hence the controversy eh?
But that's not really the point, 'Terri' isn't comming back.
About the autopsy, I did hear yesterday or the day before that the husband wants results from her autopsy.
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fate
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